Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Einsatz bei einem Grundwasseranfang bis zu 6m ab GOK (Geländeoberkante) möglich,
Kreiselpumpen selbstansaugend: HWW, HWA
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Plunschmeister
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Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Plunschmeister » Di 28. Jun 2016, 14:59

Olá!
To use teflon, for suction pipe inside, is a no go. For pump inlet side - G 1 (33mm) ok. You can use silikon and screw then the clamp over, but the silicon must be dry (24h). Try it again!
First cut a little bit from the suction pipe, this green tube is porous over time.
It`s also trash, but vacuum sealed. :oops: Low cost variant :lol: .

I think it sounds like air bubles are forming inside the suction filter.

I think so. I`m missing this typical injektor sound.
„Das Wasser ist die Kohle der Zukunft" Jules Verne (1870)
* 2712193509122015*
Gruß PM

Goahead
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Registriert: So 26. Jun 2016, 21:41

Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Goahead » Di 28. Jun 2016, 17:23

Hallo Plunschmeister

I better find a new suction hose, plastic, and try this all over again.

I found this in the 4000/4 pumpe manual:(not the "i" version)
- If the suction heights are high, use a suction hose with a small
diameter.

Should i buy a 3/4" hose and new pipe, instead of using the 1" hose, since i have about 8mm suction pipe lenght?
I dont find this statement in 4000/5i manual.
Does it really matter?

Grube
Goahead
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Plunschmeister
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Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Plunschmeister » Di 28. Jun 2016, 18:19

HI Goahead

I found this in the 4000/4 pumpe manual:(not the "i" version)
- If the suction heights are high, use a suction hose with a small
diameter.

Important is the waterlevel in the rainwater reservoir.
since i have about 8m suction pipe lenght?

New suction pipe in 1".

Delivery side connection:
Optimum delivery capacity: best results regarding the delivery capacity of the pump are achieved when connecting 18 mm (3/4") hoses.*From the handbook*
I better find a new suction hose, plastic, and try this all over again.

Yes. [My pump (Gardena 4000/4i) works over 13 years with this silicon method] :oops: sorry.
„Das Wasser ist die Kohle der Zukunft" Jules Verne (1870)
* 2712193509122015*
Gruß PM

Goahead
Beiträge: 10
Registriert: So 26. Jun 2016, 21:41

Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Goahead » Di 22. Aug 2017, 15:47

Plunschmeister hat geschrieben:HI Goahead

I found this in the 4000/4 pumpe manual:(not the "i" version)
- If the suction heights are high, use a suction hose with a small
diameter.

Important is the waterlevel in the rainwater reservoir.
since i have about 8m suction pipe lenght?

New suction pipe in 1".

Delivery side connection:
Optimum delivery capacity: best results regarding the delivery capacity of the pump are achieved when connecting 18 mm (3/4") hoses.*From the handbook*
I better find a new suction hose, plastic, and try this all over again.

Yes. [My pump (Gardena 4000/4i) works over 13 years with this silicon method] :oops: sorry.


Sorry for not replying soon...

Got back to the pump issue, but problem is still there.
I clean the pressure valve, and the flow propeller. Everything seems ok.
Pressure valve "membrane" seems ok. does it needs some kind of grease?

Reconnected everything. I use my above ground swimming pool, to be sure it was not a inlet depth problem.
So pump is sucking water for just 50cm deep water with a 1" pipe.

Pump works ok when "tap" is full open. When i start to create pressure in the outlet pipe, the pump starts to blink the green led faster and stops for 1 sec and restarts seven times till in stops with error.

It seems that inlet pipe is air tight, but when i create pressure in the outlet, i think i can ear some air leek in inlet side...not sure if air leek but for sure a change in sound of water flow.
I dont have silicon to insert in inlet connection for testing.

What else could i test/make before i send this expensive peace of carp pump to garbage?

Regards
Goahead

Goahead
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Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Goahead » Di 22. Aug 2017, 15:57

I also read this in another forum.

"Lösung für AUS/AN

Habe die 4000/4i.
Nach einem Frostschaden (Ich war mir sicher, die Pumpe im Winter in den sicheren Keller gestellt zu haben - aber das war leider im Jahr davor ..... :-)
mußte ich den Pumpendeckel und das Gehäuse des Impellers oder Druckschalters wg. Rissen ersetzen.
Lt. Liste gibt es den Druckschalter eigentlich nur komplett, mit Impeller und Drucksensor. Gardena konnte mir nach Telefonat aber dann doch das pure Gehäuse (ohne die Sensoren) schicken.
Dann alles ersetzt und zusammengebaut, Pumpe dicht und läuft.

Aber nur "im Prinzip", weil genau die Symptome meiner Vor-Poster auftraten :
Pumpe läuft ca. 20 Sek, LED grün. Dann blinkt die grüne LED langsam, Pumpe geht kurz aus, aber direkt danach wieder an. Das ganze dann innerhalb von ca. 2-3 Min einige Male AUS/An (7 mal ?). Danach schaltet sich die Pumpe komplett aus.

Da sich die übrigen "Rahmenbedingungen" nicht geändert haben, konnte es sich eigentlich nur um einen Fehler von Impeller(-sensor) oder Drucksensor handeln.

Die Lösung des Problems :

Aus dem Impellergehäuse drückt das Wasser auf eine Membran im Drucksensor, die Membran drückt auf einen kleinen Teller, der wiederum einen Taster auslöst, wenn der Druck steigt und damit den Motor abschaltet.
Naheliegend war, daß der Drucksensor durch das neue Gehäuse (evtl. anderer Querschnitt in der Bohrung zun Drucksensor) falsch justiert war.
Also Drucksensor justieren .....
Und siehe da, der Teller, der den Taster auslöst, bekommt von einer Feder "Gegendruck" (soll ja erst ab einem bestimmten Druck auslösen). Die Feder ist durch eine Inbusschraube unterhalb des Sensors justierbar. Einfach die Kappe abziehen und dann neu justieren. Der Drucksensor an sich muß gar nicht demontiert werden.
So kann man den Druckpunkt, an dem der Taster auslöst einstellen.
Ich habe da ein wenig probiert, und jetzt loooooft det alles wieder, wie es soll."

My translation to Deutsche is not that good...but for what i understood, i could try to adjust pressure valve to avoid the pump to shutdown.
I notice that pressure valve is just a switch with a spring, that when pressed down, (the diaphragm will push switch down) it will turn the pump off.

- Access pressure valve from below.
- no need to dismantle pressure valve
- release bottom cap
- alan screw to adjust pressure spring

now...screw to the left or to the right to allow more pressure?

Regards
G.

Goahead
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Registriert: So 26. Jun 2016, 21:41

Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Goahead » Di 22. Aug 2017, 18:11

Again something came into my mind.

I did notice some water drops behind the start/run switch...water drops near o-ring number 14

Isn't that a symptom of a leak in the suction side?

I will try again today..

- First i will try to remove and clean all parts of the start/run switch...check o-rings and re-assemble Parts 9 to 14 and 19 to 27 and do a test again

Bild

Regards
G.
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Plunschmeister
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Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Plunschmeister » Di 22. Aug 2017, 19:59

Hi G. and welcome back. :lol:

My translation to Deutsche is not that good...but for what i understood, i could try to adjust pressure valve to avoid the pump to shutdown.
I notice that pressure valve is just a switch with a spring, that when pressed down, (the diaphragm will push switch down) it will turn the pump off.

- Access pressure valve from below.
- no need to dismantle pressure valve
- release bottom cap
- alan screw to adjust pressure spring

now...screw to the left or to the right to allow more pressure?


He had changed the complete housing, the pressure sensor was incorrectly adjusted.I think, its not your problem.


Again something came into my mind.

I did notice some water drops behind the start/run switch...water drops near o-ring number 14

Isn't that a symptom of a leak in the suction side?


Please read here:
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=347

Change the o-rings 11 and 14 and check the screw 12. The integrated filter is clean?



Our translation tool:
Bild
„Das Wasser ist die Kohle der Zukunft" Jules Verne (1870)
* 2712193509122015*
Gruß PM

Goahead
Beiträge: 10
Registriert: So 26. Jun 2016, 21:41

Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Goahead » Mi 23. Aug 2017, 11:16

Hi Plunschmeister

Thank you so much for the link, and the time you have put into that post, trying to repair the pump.
..and you succeeded!

Yesterday a cleaned the flow propeller, rotary switch, integrated filter... again. Leak in rotary switch disappear.

I did not mount part 32 and made a test.
After a minute the pump stopped and give me a error with just the "no water" led blinking.
That tells me that the flow sensor is working.
If i close the outlet side, the pump builds the final pressure and stops (no blinking leds)...If i open the outlet again, pump starts ok...that tells me that the pressure switch also works

I reconnected/screw part 32 into place again, started the pump.
If i dont create pressure squeezing the outlet pipe, the "pump on" led will just blink slowly and pump will never stop/get errors.

If i squeeze the outlet pipe creating pressure, the led "pump on" will start to blink faster and the problem will appear...starts and stops several times till its stops with error( leds "no water" and "pump on" stay blinking).

After pump stops, i open part 18 slowly, and i can ear pressure being released...so pump as some pressure build in. probably not enough.

Before i give up, i will try the same you did...just the last part :)
I know i dont have a water Leak in rotary switch anymore, but maybe a air leak...its sucking air when building a lot of pressure.
O-rings 11 and 14 looked ok, but maybe there are stretched or to dry to hold pressure.

I will try to find those o-rings in a local store and post back when a redo the pump test.

Regards
G.

Goahead
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Registriert: So 26. Jun 2016, 21:41

Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Goahead » Fr 25. Aug 2017, 09:55

Success!

I have changed O-rings 21-17-14-11 and the pump can now hold pressure, and doesn't turn off.

It sounds way better then before, and the filter basket is now always full of water even when pressure applied in outlet.

The O-rings didnt look bad...probably part 11 and 14 made the difference.

I should have thought, why did the basket almost got empty on water when pressure applied?... inlet air leak!

Thank you for help
Kind regards
G.
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Plunschmeister
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Re: Gardena Pumpe 4000/4 i läuft nicht mehr

Beitragvon Plunschmeister » Fr 25. Aug 2017, 18:26

Hi G.
I have changed O-rings 21-17-14-11 and the pump can now hold pressure, and doesn't turn off.

Good job!

Thank you for help

With pleasure.

Kind regards
„Das Wasser ist die Kohle der Zukunft" Jules Verne (1870)
* 2712193509122015*
Gruß PM

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